Use Of Table Salt!

[Raithan Ellis]

Using the comment on cyanide as a segway...

Actually, in aquaculture, the stable form of cyanide used as an anti-caking agent in say, table salt, can be very toxic. When exposed to UVc light, such as some mussel depuration units or your aquarium's UV sterilizer, the cyanide is released into the water in it's free form.

Don't care to take my word on the toxicity factor? Feel free to contact any scientist in the aquaculture or water & wastewater industries and let us know what you find.

Not trying to start a war... just trying to clear the fact from fiction.

Either way, anti-caking agents have no benefits in aquaria. Why add them to your aquariums if you have a less expensive alternative that does not contain extras?

Hey, if table salt is handy and you have ich and don't feel like running to the store... go for it. Just make sure you kick off the UV light if you have one.

 

[RustyRay]

And as I said. The levels of cyanide are not enough to cause any harm.

Waste water is not the same as aquarium water. Cyanide does not build up in the bodies of fish. Cyanide also turns into a gas (hydrogen cyanide) in well oxygenated and circulated water and it evaporates.

The main reason aquaculturists care about cyanide is because they are selling food fish for human comsumption. Watse water management people are concerned about it because they don't want to dump back into the environment.

Cyanide is just not a concern in aquariums. But anal retentiveness has always been part of the aquarium hobby. So worry away.

 

[Raithan Ellis]

Presuming that if cyanide does not build up in the bodies of fish, why would the aquaculture industry be concerned over it at all? Following that logic, it would suggest that it would not carry over to the consumer... ?

 

[happychem]

There are a few important facts to remember here:
First, most table salts do not contain YPS as an anti-caking agent

Second, the quantities of YPS are minute

Third, most aquariums do not have UV sterilizers - they're largely a waste of money for FW systems

Fourth, No one has advised the prolonged use of salt, there are no benefits to it, so the addition of YPS to the aquarium would be short term.

Finally, and perhaps more importantly, depending on your perspective, there are no guarantees that "aquarium salt" does not use YPS.

 

[Raithan Ellis]

Happy - I see no serious issue with short term use... however this debate seems to be based on "low toxicity" rather than "no toxicity"... how about using table salt in a brackish setup?

Aside from the entire toxicity line of thought... again I dare to ask... why use something with "extra goodies" in it when there are less expensive alternatitives without such? ie... the less tainted sodium chloride (potable water softener solar salt/kiln-dried salt)

As per Aquarium Salt... that stuff is like Scotch... they can squeeze haggis sacks into the barrels and still call it Scotch. Who knows what is in Aquarium Salt.

 

[reiverix]

however this debate seems to be based on "low toxicity" rather than "no toxicity

For the long term good of my tank I would still have to go the way of salt, including table salt which I've used. Even assuming YPS, cyanide and all the nasty stuffs are in my tank during the course. I'm satisfied that the levels are just too low to create a negative effect. Now if there was constant posts saying how they were using table salt and fish were dying, then I would start getting wary.

how about using table salt in a brackish setup

Only marine salt will create a true brackish tank.

As per Aquarium Salt... that stuff is like Scotch... they can squeeze haggis sacks into the barrels and still call it Scotch. Who knows what is in Aquarium Salt.

I like a glass of Scotch with haggis, but mixed together....that would be too weird like cod banana pie with gravy.

 

[RTR]

I agree w/reiverix - Table salt cannot ever produce a BW tank. It can produce salted FW, but that is not at all BW. Brackish water is a mixture of fresh water and seawater. It is not FW supplemented with any level of table salt.

Laiphroaig with a dash of water is not at all grain alcohol and water.

 

[nursie]

Now you guys did it..I have questions...
What is the osmolality or maybe the question should be percent of salinity of fish?
Is the reccomended level of salinity to treat ich exceeding that in the fish tank?

I don't think anyone is saying that the increased salt and heat is not stressful, but meds are stressful too. Can you say which is more stressful?

And how many lay people out there pick the wrong med to toss in their tank? I've seen folks tossing antibiotics in their tank for ich...if they even know that is what they are doing. There is so much snake oil out there on the fish store shelves, I think that salt is the lesser of many evils..not even considering the cost. There are fish that cannot tolerate some of the meds out there, like loaches for example.

I had an ich outbreat and treated my tank with salt..all of my fish lived. My neighbor down the street who considers herself an "expert" fishkeeper also had an outbreak. She treated with meds and lost fish..including a clown loach she was keeping for me until my tank was cycled. She then turned around..broke the whole tank down and bleached everything to kill off the ich..she claims it lives in tanks and you never get rid of it. I , on the other hand have done nothing except treat with salt..and have had no more ich.
She kept asking how my fish were..if I had ich again...seems rather disappointed.


AND...Reiverix...haggis..You have eaten Haggis...bleah!! I've heard what's in that. I'd have to down a whale of a lot of Scotch to try it!!! Cod banana pie with gravy might be preferable..

 

[RustyRay]

"Presuming that if cyanide does not build up in the bodies of fish, why would the aquaculture industry be concerned over it at all? Following that logic, it would suggest that it would not carry over to the consumer... ?"

There is a difference between building up or accumulating in fish tissue and having a level in the fish. Mercury and other heavy metals are known to build up in animal tissues. Cyanide is not a heavy metal. But fish can ingest it. But I'm assuming that it does not accumulate or remain in the tissues for long like other toxins. Like lead in humans.

Food manufacturers have to worry about all kinds of regulations. I guess it is just one of many.

 

[daveedka]

Is the reccomended level of salinity to treat ich exceeding that in the fish tank?

I can help with one of the question Nursie.
The level needed is somewhere in the range of 2.5- 5 ppt depending on which strain of ich and how much previous exposure to salt it has had. This is devinately higher than levels should ever be in your tank outside of specific treatment periods. All Freshwater does contain some Na and CL but the levels are very very minute when compared to the levels needed for treatment.

I can re-find my calculations, but basically 3 teaspoons per gallon equates to just a bit over 6 ppt. I usually reccomend starting treatment with 2 teaspoon per gallon but there are documented cases of ich surviving higher levels than 2 teaspoon per gallon will give you.

I had an ich outbreat and treated my tank with salt..all of my fish lived. My neighbor down the street who considers herself an "expert" fishkeeper also had an outbreak. She treated with meds and lost fish..including a clown loach she was keeping for me until my tank was cycled. She then turned around..broke the whole tank down and bleached everything to kill off the ich..she claims it lives in tanks and you never get rid of it. I , on the other hand have done nothing except treat with salt..and have had no more ich.
She kept asking how my fish were..if I had ich again...seems rather disappointed.

Print up the ich article and give it to your poor neighbor. It might help or at least make her curious enough to wonder.

AND...Reiverix...haggis..You have eaten Haggis...bleah!! I've heard what's in that. I'd have to down a whale of a lot of Scotch to try it!!! Cod banana pie with gravy might be preferable..

Nursie, Never knock it 'till you try it. Maybe we could have some Haggis at the AC picnic. :idea2:
dave