Mafia #70: The Time Vortex

[Madcrawdad]

JB, don't you think it's curious that this days entire discussion has been about LadyG and the code words... yet Zsand doesn't even mention that (in any significant way)?

Don't you think it's curious that Zsand voted 3 times on day one and never got close to HN, but his final vote was on ILoveMollies?

Don't you think it's curious at all?

BTW: Zsand did vote for Wiz as did LadyG and known mafia, hooked. As far as I'm concerned, this is the best evidence that theWiz is innocent. Pending notification about any turns, if either G or Zsand is mafia, then I'll assume that theWiz is innocent.

Something that's interesting about Z's ILM vote is the reason that he gave...something like 'just to keep everyone guessing'. If you're town, it's better to establish yourself as such, through your actions, as opposed to claim to be getting your kicks by confusing others. Z knows that.

 

[noodles62]

What exactly looks staged to you, Noods? Did FF tell you to say that?

It just stuck out while I was reading things over. Just trying to find connections to HN.............

I have read everything over again and with the exception of "Fish" none of the other code words from the referenced game were used. (At least I couldnt find any)

I am beginning to wonder if either -
A. We are considering the wrong game.
or
B. the code words were all different (which would certainly account for "RAT")

 

[OgreMkV]

I dont think that they would all be on wiz, then if he turned innocent they would be looked at.

BUt if everyone was on Wiz, then it would like nothing and we'd have a lot more to try and sort through.

The close race with hooked, was the absolute worse thing that could happen to them, especially when Wiz saved himself by jumping to HN.

Z was stuck. If he moved to Wiz, then he would have forced a tie breaker, but if Wiz had won it, then everyone would be looking suspiciously at him.

But Z was on Mollies to answer your actual comment FF.

I do find all that curious, Ogre. What I find more curious is that you put it out there that you're essentially positive Zs is scum, then when I ask you about it you say "it's a gift" or somesuch; then you come up with all these great reasons... why not just put your reasons out there when I asked the first time?

Bull cookies...

This was at 10:30 last night
[QUOTE-Ogre]
So, my top suspects are (not necessarily in this order): TheWiz, Zsand, John, LadyG, Noods, Zaffy.
[/quote]

This was when I voted for Z

I vote to lynch Zsand

He is playing exactly like every other time he's been mafia. He says things, but the things he says are of no substance. For example, the quote above. One line for Hooked and nothing for LadyG when almost the entier discussion of day 2 has been LadyG.

I am perfectly happy with a LadyG/Zsand vote run.

I know that Zsand is mafia. I am perfectly happy with switching to LadyG if need be.

Now, please show me where I didn't include a single reason for voting Zsand.

Maybe he needed to "think" of them? Think being go ask is scummates. Or he really did need to think of them. OR he is a good guy and needed to ensure he wasnt looked at as scummy. OR (again) he mad an honest mistake (ha!)

I gave a reason, actually I gave another one at the very beginning of the day when I said that the multiple voters that didn't vote HN would be the top of my suspect list.

I don't understand why your pushing me so hard on the JB, if you disagree... fine. I don't care. But don't say I didn't give reasons when I did. I gave two reasons. Both that are very logical. Now, I expect at least an acknowledgment of these reasons and some kind of statement admitting that I gave the reasons previously.

Now, for all that, I don't think you're mafia JB. I'd be willing to put money on the possibility that our final two mafia re Zsand and LadyG.

 

[Dangerdoll]

TRS- Zaffy 29, JL 297
Wiz- Ogre 47, Hn 50, JL 163, Zsand 274, DD 305, Rb 426, Jb 433, LG 438, Noods 445, Rich 450, Hn 600
Zsand- Kash 62
Chaz- Zsand 141
ILM- Lab 209, Zsand 300
FF- JL 211, Chaz 264
JB- LG 243
HN- FF 267, Kash 308, Chaz 402, Mad 470, Dawg 477, Fire 496, Jb 497, Wiz 572
LG- Noods 362
Mad- Fire 492
RB- Wiz 373, Zaffy 418, JL 542

No votes from: ILM, TRS

Something that's interesting about Z's ILM vote is the reason that he gave...something like 'just to keep everyone guessing'. If you're town, it's better to establish yourself as such, through your actions, as opposed to claim to be getting your kicks by confusing others. Z knows that.

this post got me to thinking... not only did Z vote for ILM, but Labby did too... yes, Labby did try to change her vote at the very last moment... not sure if that was just to make it look good or what... all I know is that Labby is a pretty savvy player.

 

[FireDancer7905]

Apparently I've been out of this for way too long, because I'm beyond lost. I don't know what to make of the prs, especially if they change each day. How do we track scum consistently when the roles themselves are inconsistent? I'm gong to leave the game-figuring out to the bigger brains and stick to looking at the kinds of posts that make sense to me. Pulling quotes and thoughts to follow shortly.

 

[Fishfriend1]

Apparently I've been out of this for way too long, because I'm beyond lost. I don't know what to make of the prs, especially if they change each day. How do we track scum consistently when the roles themselves are inconsistent? I'm gong to leave the game-figuring out to the bigger brains and stick to looking at the kinds of posts that make sense to me. Pulling quotes and thoughts to follow shortly.

Your confused? That makes 3 of us. Me, you, and Mr.Miffel's.

 

[dirtydawg10]

There was no push for votes onto Wiz close to night. My vote was squarely on HN. But if even if it wasn't, why did you never mention that when you said you wanted to see the lynch come down to myself of LG?

Look below:

Here I said 'fish', and was pointed to by HN...


Then here you're all for an LG vs Mad runoff for lynch. When did this supposed push for votes to Wiz tweak your scumdar, as you sure hadn't mentioned it here? Why didn't you mention it?

A question for you, Dawg. Since I pushed back on your 'fish' theory, you've backed off somewhat saying that you feel better about LG being scum than myself, and that you'd rather lynch her first, see what transpires, and then perhaps lynch me based on how LG flips.... So why call for a runoff between the two of us? Seriously. By doing so, you're saying ones as good as the other, right? You feel better about LG being scum, and claim that what you learn from her could help you make a decision regarding me.

So, if you're pro-town, why would you want to take the chance of me being lynched first (by calling for a runoff), if you supposedly like LG for scum better in the first place? If I flip town, what does it tell you about LG?



I think people need to be careful about eliminating suspects with regard to interactions with Hooked Newbie. With as little as we know about the roles, and who was communicating with who, HN could have unknowingly been lynched by a teammate or two.

We know that scum had KGB, and likely a demon (based on the fact that the town had a hunter). Based on the previous game scum may have had another KGB... which would make more sense if LG was using RAT as code. Or another demon...maybe a possessed soul.

Something that I've been thinking about is that from the first game it looks like the demon recruited/possessed souls. So why didn't that happen here? Was HN the demon and lynched before he could recruit anyone? Who knows? But the bottom line is, we can't say with certaintly who HN would have been in communication with... therefore, if you're going to look to HN for clues, it's probably safer to go after those with possible connections to HN, than it is to overlook others who went head-to-head with him on D1.

It's all been said before, Mad. Here's 3 posts where I mention my thoughts before the post that you chose to quote.

I'm not setting anything out there for someone else to run with. I'm running with it all on my own.

I am more convinced about LG than I am about you which is why I am voting for her. If she turns up scum I will vote you next. If she turns up innocent it will be obvious that fish has nothing to do with anything. I have suspected LG since D1 and this just sealed it for me is all. What do you think of LG using fish and rat in one post?

The word fish appearing in other games has nothing to do with this game. We have already seen HN's use of the word fish in a strange way. The code words are also how we got busted in the original KGB game so that's why I went there first. I do need to go back and review HN's posts and what others have said about HN on D1. I will say I am still confused by your vote on HN if you are scum which is another reason I am not voting for you right now.

When I personally used the code words in the first game it was not to say anything. It was a signal to others that knew the code to stay away from votes on others that used the codes. However some did chose to vote for others that used the code word. It was a way to know who the innocents were and who was on your side. We couldn't communicate so it was the only way we had to signal each other as to who we were.

So my posts are absent of any substance on D1? I pointed out why I thought HN was scum and voted for him. He was scum. That is not my only substance on D1 either. Go back and read my posts. I did read your posts. How's this for substance?

Your reasoning for voting for HN.



Not much substance. This is the only thing I could find you saying about HN and why you were voting him. I think you got stuck on HN and couldn't move your vote because it would look scummy. Then when my vote went to HN and others saw what i saw and started voting HN here is what you posted...



You trying to get JB to move his vote after he expressed concerns about HN's possible UD.



Again trying to get JB to move even calling him "afraid" to move.



Then trying to get Lab to at least make it a tie.

And HN at the end with a possible slip post to you saying he knew it wouldn't work. Maybe he was setting you up or maybe he was trying to clear you by being so obvious about it.

So Mad, why will you not be voting for LG? Why does she not seem scummy to you?

I was helpful by trying to keep people from moving off of HN when he retracted his vote. You on the other hand were trying to coax others into moving their vote to Wiz? Why? No need to poll the Town...I know what I did on D1.

You're right you have 2 posts about HN and why you voted them and three posts trying to get people to vote for Wiz close to nightfall.

"happy pills" ...lol...that is not one of the code words unless I'm misreading the post that says Snow, Fish, North, Cold Water and Blizzard were the code words from the last game. Feel free to vote for me at any time here Mad. Or are you waiting for someone to make the first move?

It is tough to say about the whole fish theory...I agree as I have said before. However in my opinion if LG turns up evil Mad would be the next obvious choice. I also agree that the information on LG is much more convincing with the caps on the word RAT and fish in the same post. That's why I'm voting LG. I have expressed my own concerns about the fish theory previously. I have said my evidence on Mad and the word fish wasn't great and stated why. The only reason Mad has come more to light as far as I'm concerned is because he seems to be pushing the issue harder than he needs to. Everyone including me seems to agree that the fish evidence on him isn't great. But he shouldn't get a pass either. To me the more convincing evidence on Mad is his push for votes on Wiz close to night. It's not the fish thing.

The reason I mentioned a run off between you and LG is because LG is my top suspect and you are second on the list. As I said several times...it has much more to do with your actions close to night...with the fish thing being a possibility. You are the one who chose to stay focused on only the fish thing...not me. You are still focused on it as a matter of fact. You seem to have glossed over all of the other things that make you looks suspicious. Yes it was the fish thing that got me looking closer at you though.

 

[Rbishop]

FF..how about stopping with all the ridiculous pic attachments...plenty of room for them at other GCC threads...

 

[Lady G]

Ok, finally home and trying to get caught up on everything. Of course I can see why everyone is looking at me, but really guys/gals do you truly think if I were scum I would use TWO code words in one post? No, I wouldn't plain and simple. The only reason I did all caps on the word Rat was just for stress, nothing more. As I said it was a joke that's it. Now if you really think I would be so stupid to post something so obvious I guess you do not know me. If I were mafia, I would of known at nightfall everyone would know what game we were in and figure it out, I would never of done that.

Now I have some questions I need to answer, so I will pull posts and answer them.

 

[jbradt]

BUt if everyone was on Wiz, then it would like nothing and we'd have a lot more to try and sort through.

The close race with hooked, was the absolute worse thing that could happen to them, especially when Wiz saved himself by jumping to HN.

Z was stuck. If he moved to Wiz, then he would have forced a tie breaker, but if Wiz had won it, then everyone would be looking suspiciously at him.

But Z was on Mollies to answer your actual comment FF.



Bull cookies...

This was at 10:30 last night
[QUOTE-Ogre]
So, my top suspects are (not necessarily in this order): TheWiz, Zsand, John, LadyG, Noods, Zaffy.

This was when I voted for Z



Now, please show me where I didn't include a single reason for voting Zsand.



I gave a reason, actually I gave another one at the very beginning of the day when I said that the multiple voters that didn't vote HN would be the top of my suspect list.

I don't understand why your pushing me so hard on the JB, if you disagree... fine. I don't care. But don't say I didn't give reasons when I did. I gave two reasons. Both that are very logical. Now, I expect at least an acknowledgment of these reasons and some kind of statement admitting that I gave the reasons previously.

Now, for all that, I don't think you're mafia JB. I'd be willing to put money on the possibility that our final two mafia re Zsand and LadyG.[/QUOTE]
I'm not saying I disagree... or that I agree. And I don't feel as though I've pushed you too hard. I'm trying to figure things out... so I asked how you could be so sure. Instead of giving even a summary of the case you laid out here, you said "it's a gift".

And actually I'm starting to like the idea of a run off with Zs and LG...